"How Can I Improve..."

Noisy · Post by **Noisy** » Sat May 07, 2016 9:46 pm

Thanks for the advice everyone. Are the entries frozen now or can they still be changed?

NWOWWE · Post by **NWOWWE** » Sun May 08, 2016 11:00 am

Well the deadline has passed so...

British-Robotics · Post by **British-Robotics** » Mon May 09, 2016 3:25 pm

I need to come up with a better lightweight for future tournaments, but the problem is that I seem to really fail only on that section. I'm trying to come up with a decent design that doesn't involve flippers, bricks and spinners, maybe I should could come up with a horizontal, claw crushing LW. But again I'm wondering if that too will backfire.

Post by **Badnik96** » Mon May 09, 2016 7:58 pm

Horizontal crushers don't have a good track record in ARC, but they haven't been done very often. Maybe you could find something that works. :)

Post by **Hooray For Lexan** » Mon May 09, 2016 11:40 pm

The major problem with crushers IMO is what the D&D community calls "Multi Ability Dependence." Basically, a spinner needs a powerful weapon, decent armor, but can get by with a fairly weak drivetrain. "Match-controlling" designs, i.e. wedges, lifters, and flippers, need a powerful drivetrain and strong armor, but can do fine with just a few points in weapon or even none at all. Hammers are a little more challenging; they need decent speed and traction to aim their weapon, plenty of power to punch through the armor of bricks, and strong armor of their own so that spinners don't just mop the floor with them.

Crushers have it worst, though. They need speed, traction, weapon, armor, and possibly even torque because a grabbed opponent can still push them into the hazards.

For a horizontal crusher you probably want at least 10 armor, giving you a weapon armor of 12 which should hold up okay to spinners despite them being sharp and pokey. You also want at least 12 weapon so you can at least penetrate the stronger bricks and threaten to KO spinners. But that only gives you 8 points for your drive, which means something like 4 speed, 3 traction: wedges will run rings around you.

But... what about a walking crusher, with the weapon mounted on a turret (3 points) and able to lift opponents up and down slowly (2 points)? That gives you something like:

Speed 4, Traction 3, Torque 2, Armor 10, Weapon 17 (3 turret, 2 lifter, 12 crusher). The turret and the lifter compensate for the slow and low-torque drivetrain, and you can still tank a couple spinner hits. The disadvantage is you'd have to come up with a convincing walking mechanism.

Alternately you could keep your wheels but use a lifting clamp like Big Nipper instead of a crusher:

Speed 6, Traction 4, Torque 3, Armor 10, Weapon 7 (5 clamp, 5 lifter) or
Speed 6, Traction 5, Torque 2, Armor 10, Weapon 7 (5 clamp, 5 lifter)

Post by **Venice Queen** » Tue May 10, 2016 12:00 am

<blockquote class='quote_blockquote'><dl><dt>HotDealsInTexas</dt><dd>May 9 2016, 11:40 PM</dd></dl><div>For a horizontal crusher you probably want at least 10 armor, giving you a weapon armor of 12 which should hold up okay to spinners despite them being sharp and pokey. You also want at least 12 weapon so you can at least penetrate the stronger bricks and threaten to KO spinners. But that only gives you 8 points for your drive, which means something like 4 speed, 3 traction: wedges will run rings around you.[/quote]I disagree. if you're going to make a horizontal clamp, you should just enter it into competitions in which there are few spinners and hope for the best. I'd also suggest doing something like I do on Cuddle Time! and Big Spoon!, where you give it a rear plow with some sort of armor bonus.

I think that making a horizontal clamp is a better bet than trying to make something that actually crushes effectively from the sides, though I am of the opinion that horizontal weapons will never be particularly effective (though I'd like to see it work)

British-Robotics · Post by **British-Robotics** » Tue May 10, 2016 2:03 am

Hmm, I'm liking the walking robot idea but like you said, It may take some time to come up with a design like that, A wheeled robot with a lifting clamp may sound like a wise idea. but now it depends on the body shape of the robot itself.

Looking at Kan-Opener fro Robot Wars his jaws only gets stuck and lodged into the robots side armourment which I don't want. I'll come up with a concept design.

BEES · Post by **BEES** » Wed May 11, 2016 12:59 pm

I think clamps/crushers can work IRL but they tend to need modular parts. Note BiteForce's anti-spinner plow or clamping attachments, depending on the matchup.

This is very difficult to convey in a stat system. You can't just change your stat points between fights but that's essentially what these robots do.

NWOWWE · Post by **NWOWWE** » Wed May 11, 2016 1:06 pm

<blockquote class='quote_blockquote'><dl><dt>Spatula</dt><dd>May 11 2016, 12:59 PM</dd></dl><div>You can't just change your stat points between fights but that's essentially what these robots do.[/quote]Don't tell Joey that!

British-Robotics · Post by **British-Robotics** » Tue May 24, 2016 1:21 am

This is the design I've done for my new LW called Padlock

LW - Padlock

This robot has a lifter/vertical crusher weapon in order to grab the opponents, the jaws itself can widen at a 45 degree angle outwards is order to broaden the opportunity to grab the opponent whilst the actual weapon that holds the claws can rotate in a 180 degree angle and it is a 2WD driven machine for better maneuverability, the front of the robot has a hinged shovel at the front for good protection.

The weapon can help the robot self right ins case it is turned over since the motors that control the weapon are strong enough to do the job.

Stats:
Speed: 6
Traction: 4
Torque: 3
Armor: 10
Weapon: 7 (5 clamp, 5 lifter)

I'm still considering to enter with this robot in the next tournament but I can't quite point my finger out as to how to improve the set of jaws. Make them broaden and wider?

patrickrowberry · Post by **patrickrowberry** » Thu Jun 23, 2016 1:14 pm

i'm working on vacuum powered robot (think a mini hover-boat with a drum)

would it be classed as a hover bot despite the fact it will be touching the floor
but will have no wheels

Post by **Hooray For Lexan** » Thu Jun 23, 2016 5:11 pm

<blockquote class='quote_blockquote'><dl><dt>British-Robotics</dt><dd>May 24 2016, 01:21 AM</dd></dl><div>
I'm still considering to enter with this robot in the next tournament but I can't quite point my finger out as to how to improve the set of jaws. Make them broaden and wider?
[/quote]Design and stats look pretty good. I especially like the rear wedge for fighting spinners. The main issue I see is that, as you said, the jaws should probably be wider.

Also, my personal preference would be to make a design like that front-wheel drive so that the clamp itself doesn't move side to side much as you turn. This will give you better precision in grabbing onto an opponent.

Mole55 · Post by **Mole55** » Sat Jul 23, 2016 6:23 am

Is there anything currently in the rules for gyroscopic procession?

The Monsterworks · Post by **The Monsterworks** » Sat Jul 23, 2016 7:49 am

<blockquote class='quote_blockquote'><dl><dt>Mole55</dt><dd>Jul 23 2016, 06:23 AM</dd></dl><div>Is there anything currently in the rules for gyroscopic procession?[/quote]As far as I know, there isn't. However, I'm working on a draft version for CBC as I'd like people to enter some novel designs. As it stands Currently, there's nothing on the books, although I think that bots using gyroscopic precession wouldn't be eligible for a walker bonus. However, they also wouldn't need to invest any points into their drivetrains. Somebody already proposed a bot that works on a slightly different type of gyroscopic precession. Here's my tentative reply:

<blockquote class='quote_blockquote'><dl><dt>Quote:</dt><dd> </dd></dl><div>Tentatively, I'd say that the speed should be governed by the weapon power divided by 4 rounded up or down to the nearest whole number (up if it falls halfway between). Traction would be the weapon power divided by 6, and torque would be the weapon power divided by eight. It will be applied as a bonus and not cost any stat points.

So basically, 30-4 (actuated legs) gives you 26 points and you don't have to invest in a drive train. You could potentially go 16 weapon and 10 armour and have a 4/2/2 drive train be another scary Eldritch Abomination (this also equates to 34 points). Congratulations. [/quote]

If you're thinking of going pure gyro without any actuated parts, then you're basically just getting free drivetrain points. That's how I'll pilot my provisional rules for now. We'll see how it works out.

Post by **Venice Queen** » Sat Jul 23, 2016 2:52 pm

Under the current rules, Badnik made a clone of No Fly Zone (propeller bot) and IIRC his forwards speed was something like 1/2 his weapon power (he should correct me if I'm wrong since i can't seem to find where we decided on that). I imagine something similar would be done for a gyroscopic procession bot, and then you'd also have to give a weapon point to the thing that turns your weapon so you can actually proceed gyroscopically :P